stud!

Love him but the community is too quick to annoint players. Looks at TRich and Martin rankings last year. Following those projections to just that, projecting too much.

The community needs a tier based ranking system for understanding floors and ceilings of players...as well as values of players to specific team needs during your window of competition.

The goal is to win. You would never win if you only have high ranked dynasty assets rostered.

Obviously off topic but part of a larger discussion. It is happening all over again where Lacy and Gio are the new Trent and Martin.

ravenlunatics said:

Love him but the community is too quick to annoint players. Looks at TRich and Martin rankings last year. Following those projections to just that, projecting too much.

The community needs a tier based ranking system for understanding floors and ceilings of players...as well as values of players to specific team needs during your window of competition.

The goal is to win. You would never win if you only have high ranked dynasty assets rostered.

Obviously off topic but part of a larger discussion. It is happening all over again where Lacy and Gio are the new Trent and Martin.

Your stance is arguable, no question, but you also have to keep in mind that DraftCalc thinking, community-based or site-based, has landed them most years. This is the first year we have seen such disastrous situations and busts, so I think it's almost not quite on the money to suggest those examples, Martin, Trich, mean not to think like we are thinking (ranking Allen No. 9 or higher). If we took the tiered approach and weren't quick to anoint, not as many DC users would own players like Dez Bryant, Arian Foster (in the past), etc. So, are you right in reflecting back on 2013? Sure, but in years past, a conservative eye wouldn't have landed some of the beasts we have. I admit, 2013 was a down year for me, but that's really 1 year out of about 9 that I haven't hit some serious lands out of a limited Upside Board list of 10 at a time... and, Josh Gordon was on our upside board, so was Shane Vereen, we didn't go conservative on either.. Go bold or go home, that's DC's take :) (not suggesting you are not on board with DC or anything negative toward you, just in general, we don't anoint slowly, never will. It's extreme, always will be. We all need some balance, though, so sometimes I try to not always go big :) One strange year, where everyone had bust predictions, that won't scare me into being conservative :)

bmxholden1 said:

+1 love the approach Smitty. I also love the fact that RavingLunatic explained the reasons he doesn't want to jump the gun. It helps me re-think my positions. Having said that, if anything Allen is getting under-estimated. I haven't seen one corner yet that can press cover him and contain him on his secondary cut yet, he gets separation, sometimes by 5 yards. I even watch him on plays Rivers goes elsewhere and the guy is open every &@$?! Play. So while some guys get anointed too soon because they found a nice situation, this guy is getting anointed cuz nobody can covering, he has epic open field running ability, he has toughness like Steve Smith, I think he thinks he's 5'8", and he can make every catch. Only thing stopping this guy is himself, bad QB, or constant double-teams, which is a distinct possibility, although you can't rank based on that.

Right, and @ravenlunatics know that your approach is just fine, nothing wrong with it, there isnt anything wrong with anyone's approach or stance. Hope it didn't come out that way, but DC doesn't hold back. That's your job as the user to balance our "hey, here this player comes" with your own rankings/thinking, so you are almost your own guide through our bold madness :)

I've got him at 14, been looking to next year and making my own rankings for a few weeks now.... He's got the "it" factor like Steve Smith and Andre Johnson, by that I mean willing to go get the ball while its in the air.  Not all receivers have that, but more have been developing that in recent years than every before.

I like DraftCalc's approach to finding potential studs early. However, I'm also cautious and like to pick and choose which ones I really like as well. I will try to draft the ones I really like (like Gio, Hilton, Gordon this year) even slightly early relative to ADP. I try to grab others with upside if they fall to me (which didn't exactly happen this year as I was hoping for guys like David Wilson to fall), and I will try to mix in put in a couple solid value picks that aren't upside guys (like Andre Brown - although he ended up getting injured after the draft). Going all upside guys can get you in trouble if you wait too long for your guys to emerge.

ump said:

I like DraftCalc's approach to finding potential studs early. However, I'm also cautious and like to pick and choose which ones I really like as well. I will try to draft the ones I really like (like Gio, Hilton, Gordon this year) even slightly early relative to ADP. I try to grab others with upside if they fall to me (which didn't exactly happen this year as I was hoping for guys like David Wilson to fall), and I will try to mix in put in a couple solid value picks that aren't upside guys (like Andre Brown - although he ended up getting injured after the draft). Going all upside guys can get you in trouble if you wait too long for your guys to emerge.

Well, I also make it pretty clear to NOT always take players where we rank em. It's gotta be a balance between:

1) where DC ranks players
2) where you rank them
3) then all that against the ADP

I could have him no3 tomorrow, yet I would t suggest you draft him there. But if I think he will be 3rd, you will see him 3rd - I won't play it safe. I don't adjust to ADP because I want you guys to see my sleepers standout. Too often people think I'm saying to draft them (in this case Allen) where they are ranked. That's what ADPs and the draft rank lists are for.

Dez Bryant was no4 on my rankings heading into 2012, but he wasn't in most anyone's top 15WRs.. Of course that was my way of saying "sleeper!", not "draft him 4!"

Just thought I'd clarify a bit... Good discussion!

garyzab said:

I don't trust Rivers having a repeat season and Matthews staying healthy.

Valid points but, HC McCoy is an offensive genius... So if Rivers stinks it up and Mathews goes down, Allen will still get his. Don't forget, McCoy was the OC in DEN when Tebow was QB... He put Tebow in position to succeed, in other words, he gets the most out of his players by gearing his offense to his players skills. Before Tebow, Orton had his best year with McCoy as his OC.

Nice post Junkie.

McCoy builds his offense around his talent.

Smitty said:

ump said:

I like DraftCalc's approach to finding potential studs early. However, I'm also cautious and like to pick and choose which ones I really like as well. I will try to draft the ones I really like (like Gio, Hilton, Gordon this year) even slightly early relative to ADP. I try to grab others with upside if they fall to me (which didn't exactly happen this year as I was hoping for guys like David Wilson to fall), and I will try to mix in put in a couple solid value picks that aren't upside guys (like Andre Brown - although he ended up getting injured after the draft). Going all upside guys can get you in trouble if you wait too long for your guys to emerge.

Well, I also make it pretty clear to NOT always take players where we rank em. It's gotta be a balance between:

1) where DC ranks players
2) where you rank them
3) then all that against the ADP

I could have him no3 tomorrow, yet I would t suggest you draft him there. But if I think he will be 3rd, you will see him 3rd - I won't play it safe. I don't adjust to ADP because I want you guys to see my sleepers standout. Too often people think I'm saying to draft them (in this case Allen) where they are ranked. That's what ADPs and the draft rank lists are for.

Dez Bryant was no4 on my rankings heading into 2012, but he wasn't in most anyone's top 15WRs.. Of course that was my way of saying "sleeper!", not "draft him 4!"

Just thought I'd clarify a bit... Good discussion!

well said Smitty...